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Anonymous Posted on Mar 11, 2010

New GE coffee maker #169209 (1300 watt) 12 cup digital. House lights flicker when in hot plate warming mode. Tried on 15 amp GFI circuit and then on dedicated 30 amp #10 wired circuit -- but same problem. Oscilloscope (measuring voltage across series shunt) reveals that there is almost a dead short for 1 to 3 60 Hz cycles (depending on the hot plate setting of 1 2, 3) before going off for another number of cycles. This short/off cycle continues for a couple of minutes and then ceases entirely for several additional minutes before the whole short/off cycling starts again. Called GE and they said it was defective, got another and it does the same thing. Why does GE want to operate the warm cycle in this fashion? Perhaps to prevent the hot plate from burning up when there is either no coffee in the pot or the pot is removed? Is this normal? It is interesting to note that the AVERAGE power during these short/off cycles is either 200, 400, 600 watts as the book says.

  • Anonymous Mar 11, 2010

    This is an unacceptable method of powering the warming plate. We can not have all the lights in our house flickering -- as though an arc welder was being turned on and off every 1/10 second. Need solution to elliminate the problem.


    New GE coffee maker #169209 (1300 watt) 12 cup digital. All house lights flicker when in hot plate warming mode. Tried on both 15 amp GFI circuit and dedicated 30 amp #10 wired circuit.

    Oscilloscope (measuring voltage across series shunt) reveals a super high INSTANTANEOUS current draw massively exceeding the breaker rating for only 1 to 3 60 Hz cycles (depending on hot plate setting of 1, 2,or 3) before going completely off for another number of cycles. This high draw/off cycle continues for a minute (warming) and then ceases entirely for several additional minutes (rest) before the whole high draw/off cycling repeats.

    Called GE and they said it was defective, got another and it does the same thing.

    Why does GE want to operate the warm cycle in this fashion? Perhaps to prevent the hot plate from burning up when there is either no coffee in the pot or the pot is removed? Is this normal? It is interesting to note that the AVERAGE POWER during these short/off cycles is either 200, 400, 600 watts as the book says.

  • Anonymous Mar 11, 2010

    New GE coffee maker #169209 (1300 watt) 12 cup digital. All house lights flicker when in hot plate warming mode. Tried on both 15 amp GFI circuit and dedicated 30 amp #10 wired circuit.

    Oscilloscope (measuring voltage across series shunt) reveals a super high INSTANTANEOUS current draw massively exceeding the breaker rating for only 1 to 3 60 Hz cycles (depending on hot plate setting of 1, 2,or 3) before going completely off for another number of cycles. This high draw/off cycle continues for a minute (warming) and then ceases entirely for several additional minutes (rest) before the whole high draw/off cycling repeats.

    Called GE and they said it was defective, got another and it does the same thing.

    Why does GE want to operate the warm cycle in this fashion? Perhaps to prevent the hot plate from burning up when there is either no coffee in the pot or the pot is removed? Is this normal? It is interesting to note that the AVERAGE POWER during these short/off cycles is either 200, 400, 600 watts as the book says.

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Hmm interesting i found this post ,,i too have the same coffee pot with the same problem all the lights in my house flicker even the frig light ,,thinking i might have a major electrical problem now im wondering if its the coffee pot thats the problem,,i do notice the coffee pot makes a click noise then after a few moments another click and that is the same times the lights flicker ,, is this possible even when some lights are on different circut breakers ,,i mean its every light in the house even lamps plugged into outlets ,bathroom lights, bedroom ,all lights in house , its a real fast flickering that last for a short moment stops for about 2 mins then starts again

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  • Posted on Mar 11, 2010
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Hi, then it might be a factory fault problem, i will advise you to call in a electrician to come and witness it whenever you put it on so that he will be able to identify weather it is the microwave's fault or an electrical fault...

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How many micro wave ovens will a 20 amp circuit support?

Please stick with me to the end ... some examples are for example only. There is no 1000 watt circuit per'ci.

This will not be possible overload, this is an accident waiting to jump on you, my friend

Install dedicated circuits for these ovens, my friend. It will cost you a little but will be better than having dissatisfied guests or talking to the zoning board or boarding house authority or (gasp) the fire inspector after the fire.

If you don't do this, when the breakers start flipping off, tenants will run extension cords to outlets that have power. A whole different and worse, problem!

Rule of thumb, lighting circuits should be designed to operate at 80%, for example, if you have 800 watts of lights on a 1000 watt circuit, you are at the max.

So, there is a possibility that your circuit for lights is already near max. Adding ovens is trouble. Don't forget the iPOds and cell phone chargers as well as lap top chargers, walkman chargers (older students), little TV's, DVD players, clock radio's, electric shavers, curling irons, steamers, popcorn makers, lava lamps and occasional electric heaters that will be snuck into the room.

What is a 1000 watt circuit ... good question. Ohms law comes into play here.

Volts X Amps = Watts
120 volts X 8.333 amps = 500 watts (a smoothie blender) 300 watts (slow cooker) 200 watts (hand mixer) = 1000 watts.


A 15 amp circuit will protect #14 wire and can carry about 1800 watts (a toaster (1500 watts), for example).

A 20 amp circuit will protect #12 wire and can carry about 2400 watts (i am using a big paint brush here. these numbers are pretty close but not exact and I am not a licensed electrician.)

When I wire, I aim lots lower, preferring to OVER build than to under build.

10 amp circuits are rare in modern homes. In general practice, if the need was to be protected at 10 amps, the wire used in the circuit would be #14 and it would be protected by the breaker at 10 amps. In this case, it is the device plugged into this 10 amp circuit that needs protection rather than the #14 wire (which would be technically oversized)

Another consideration for you is where is the water? If you have an outlet that is 5 feet from a water source (bath - kitchen - etc) it must be protected by a GFIC

A 30 amp circut will protect #10 wire --- but this is not a normal household circuit.

Maybe the best option is for you to have your electrician install a sub panel in the vicinity of use and run several 20 amp circuits from that location to the various rooms.

The answer to your question "How many (1150 watt)micro wave ovens will a 20 (amp circuit handle)" is TWO with nothing else on the line. The National Code requires dedicated circuits for micro wave ovens, BTW. A commercial application may have a different (more stringent) standard in your town.

Thanks for the opportunity to answer your question and thanks for your interest in FixYa.com

Please vote - positive comments appreciated by volunteer question catchers.

thanks

a
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Sorry, have owned a lemon or two myself.
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Two possible causes.

First (and most likely) the circuit is being overloaded. This kitchen circuit may be shared with another appliance (like the refrigerator) which is drawing enough power when both are running to trip the breaker. A Typical kitchen circuit is 20 amp with #12 wiring. So an 1800 watt microwave might draw 13 or 14 amps while a fridge compressor kicking in can surpass 7 amps before it levels off. If this is an older home the kitchen may have a 15 amp circuit with #14 wiring. If the circuit is a 20 amp you will have to split the appliances onto separate circuits. (Under code a kitchen must have a minimum of 2 separate appliance circuits). If it is a 15 amp you might be able to split them as well or may be looking up upgrading the breaker and the wiring from 15amp #14 to 20 amp #12 (but you could still have the same problem).

The other possibility is a short or loose connection. If splitting appliances onto their own circuits doesn't fix this you would probably want an electrician to come in and check for other underlying causes which could represent a fire hazard.

Hope this helps.
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