Napoleon 36" Zero Clearance Top/Rear Vent Natural Gas Fireplace with Black Door Logo
Anonymous Posted on Feb 04, 2010

How do you check a thermopile? MY pilot is on but it wont light. I checked the manifold and its all cleared. Thinking its my thermoplie not telling the switch to open.

  • Anonymous Feb 10, 2010

    Thanks I checked it with the leads off and it read nothing. Then I hooked it up and it slwly went up past 500(maybe because it was warm? not sure if it was on the right setting or not my meter didnt have anything marked mv. I was using a 2000m dvc setting. Thanks alot. Arer you located near johnstown pa?

  • Anonymous Feb 11, 2013

    use a lighter to heat thermopile it will tell the switch to open once you heat it up..

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John Rodgers

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  • Posted on Feb 08, 2010
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A thermcouple is what keeps pilot on, if your unit has both a thermocouple and thermopile then your pilot CAN stay lit and main burner not come on.do not buy a gas vavle untill you check the thermopile voltage!! very costy blunder.this is how you test it..( open circuit test) Disconnect thermopile leads from valve. take a volt meter set it to millivolts- set it to a mv reading above 500 so that you can test it correctly, my meter has 2000 setting and I use that. connect T/P leads to meter leads.. reading should be 500mv.
( closed circuit test) connect leads of meter to terminals that your thermostat or on/off swich are hooked too, usually top and bottom terminals on most gas valves, turn unit on and reading should be 150mv or more... you need try open circuit. I can test your vavle too if you like keep me posted if I helped or not. 15 yrs experience in gas repairs!!

  • John Rodgers
    John Rodgers Feb 10, 2010

    On your F/p thermopile does not have to work in order for pilot to come on, the thermopile is for allowing gas to flow to burner. replace it at a cheap cost or go with the $$$$$$ gas valve. your unit has both thermopile and thermocouple, thermocouple for pilot, thermopile for burner. It may still be the valve but go with cheapest easiest things first, in all the years i have worked I have replaced less than 20 valves and that is being generous to say that many and I have replaced hundreds of thermopiles and thermocouples

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  • Posted on Feb 04, 2010
Anonymous
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Hi, the thermopile generator is what keeps your pilot lite, and sends a small amount of electricity called milivolts to the gas valve to open. If the unit will not fire up and the pilot is on, the fault would be in the valve its self. The thermopile is what tells the coil on the main gas valve to open, but if the pilot light lights it is sending the correct voltage (milivolts) to the gas valve coil to open. The valve is faulty and will need to be replaced. Please keep me posted.
Sincerely,
Shastalaker7

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  • Anonymous Feb 10, 2010

    The thermopile generator or thermocouple created milivolts to keep the pilot lit. I have been in the heating business for 30 years and more and this is a fact. If in fact the pilot is lit and you have checked the control stat, and all is working properly, then you need to go to the gas valve. The pilot will not stay lit if the thermopile generator and or thermocouple is not working. If you have no pilot, you will need to check them with the correct meter to see if they are indeed putting out the right millivolts.
    Sincerely, Shastalaker7

  • smi6086 Jan 07, 2011

    Could it be a gas supply pressure problem? I notice my pilot flame hardly touches the thermocouple and only "grazes" the thermopile. Symptoms are that the pilot frequently extinguishes and when the fire is demanded on by the thermostat there is often up to a ten minute delay before the valve opens and the fire lights up. It will then sometimes shut down for no reason at all, sometimes leaving the pilot light lit and sometimes extinguishing the pilot as well.
    Is this a supply problem or is it the gas valve?

  • Anonymous Dec 07, 2017

    Clean the orifice in the bottom of the pilot assembly. That will restore the pilot flame to its original size. It is a VERY small orifice, do not use a metal object to clean. Usually it can be blown out with air.

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The pilot light orifice may be partially blocked from dirty gas supply. Clean the orifice with a fine brush and some compressed air so the flame will heat both the thermocouple and the thermopile adequately. Also re tighten the connections for proper ground also the electrical connections. Al The Handyman Works.

KD Grayson Heating,Air conditioning & Refrigeration

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  • Posted on Dec 16, 2013
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Despite the simplicity of a Millivolt system,troubleshooting them is often not as simple, if you go by the book using a Volt/Ohm meter to test the generator and gas valve. The Pilot Generators are less tricky as they all put out 750 mv or 3/4 of a volt out of the system, in the system is where each result will be specific according to what gas valve is used, not all gas valves have the same ohm's values, and many newer gas valves cannot be ohmed due to the design!
They will read open every one of them.
The way to make it simple and assure you never get any call backs
is to take a AA battery and attach a wire to each end of the battery,
Radio shack sells battery boxes with leads built in for several dollars.
Remove the 2 leads from the gas valve coming from the pilot generator and replace them with the AA battery leads If the gas valve operates normally via battery, it is a good gas valve, if not it is bad.
If you apply voltage to the gas valve and get zero amp draw,the gas valve is bad. Do not leave the battery in place and operate the unit in this manner unless you are able to be diligently watching it, never sleep or leave etc, it is strictly for emergency use or testing.
Old time units had no pilot safety, the pilot valve was manually operated just like a garden hose, if the wind blew it out it still kept coming, however as natural gas is lighter than air it will vent if it is allowed to via the flue, propane units must have 100% safety for the pilots operation as propane is heavier than air and will not vent, it settles in the lowest spot making propane more dangerous in that respect than natural gas is.
750 mv is 3/4 of 1 volt, not much power, the thermopile makes this power by having 2 dissimilar metals co joined in the end of the thermopiles that impinges the pilot flame.
A temperature differential must be maintained across the thermopiles end, if the entire end of the thermopile is hot the power will drop off or stop all together, thus extinguishing the pilot.
Many homeowners make the mistake of setting the thermopile too far into the flame, heating the entire end, not just the top 1/3 portion thinking this will bake it into submission, or force it to make power when in reality it does the opposite.

  • KD Grayson Heating,Air conditioning & Refrigeration

    Despite the simplicity of a Millivolt system,troubleshooting them is often not as simple, if you go by the book using a Volt/Ohm meter to test the generator and gas valve. The Pilot Generators are less tricky as they all put out 750 mv or 3/4 of a volt out of the system, in the system is where each result will be specific according to what gas valve is used, not all gas valves have the same ohm's values, and many newer gas valves cannot be ohmed due to the design!

    They will read open every one of them.

    The way to make it simple and assure you never get any call backs

    is to take a AA battery and attach a wire to each end of the battery,

    Radio shack sells battery boxes with leads built in for several dollars.

    Remove the 2 leads from the gas valve coming from the pilot generator and replace them with the AA battery leads If the gas valve operates normally via battery, it is a good gas valve, if not it is bad.

    If you apply voltage to the gas valve and get zero amp draw,the gas valve is bad. Do not leave the battery in place and operate the unit in this manner unless you are able to be diligently watching it, never sleep or leave etc, it is strictly for emergency use or testing.

    Old time units had no pilot safety, the pilot valve was manually operated just like a garden hose, if the wind blew it out it still kept coming, however as natural gas is lighter than air it will vent if it is allowed to via the flue, propane units must have 100% safety for the pilots operation as propane is heavier than air and will not vent, it settles in the lowest spot making propane more dangerous in that respect than natural gas is.

    750 mv is 3/4 of 1 volt, not much power, the thermopile makes this power by having 2 dissimilar metals co joined in the end of the thermopiles that impinges the pilot flame.

    A temperature differential must be maintained across the thermopiles end, if the entire end of the thermopile is hot the power will drop off or stop all together, thus extinguishing the pilot.

    Many homeowners make the mistake of setting the thermopile too far into the flame, heating the entire end, not just the top 1/3 portion thinking this will bake it into submission, or force it to make power when in reality it does the opposite.

  • KD Grayson Heating,Air conditioning & Refrigeration

    Despite the simplicity of a Millivolt system,troubleshooting them is often not as simple, if you go by the book using a Volt/Ohm meter to test the generator and gas valve. The Pilot Generators are less tricky as they all put out 750 mv or 3/4 of a volt out of the system, in the system is where each result will be specific according to what gas valve is used, not all gas valves have the same ohm's values, and many newer gas valves cannot be ohmed due to the design!

    They will read open every one of them.

    The way to make it simple and assure you never get any call backs

    is to take a AA battery and attach a wire to each end of the battery,

    Radio shack sells battery boxes with leads built in for several dollars.

    Remove the 2 leads from the gas valve coming from the pilot generator and replace them with the AA battery leads If the gas valve operates normally via battery, it is a good gas valve, if not it is bad.

    If you apply voltage to the gas valve and get zero amp draw,the gas valve is bad. Do not leave the battery in place and operate the unit in this manner unless you are able to be diligently watching it, never sleep or leave etc, it is strictly for emergency use or testing.

    Old time units had no pilot safety, the pilot valve was manually operated just like a garden hose, if the wind blew it out it still kept coming, however as natural gas is lighter than air it will vent if it is allowed to via the flue, propane units must have 100% safety for the pilots operation as propane is heavier than air and will not vent, it settles in the lowest spot making propane more dangerous in that respect than natural gas is.

    750 mv is 3/4 of 1 volt, not much power, the thermopile makes this power by having 2 dissimilar metals co joined in the end of the thermopiles that impinges the pilot flame.

    A temperature differential must be maintained across the thermopiles end, if the entire end of the thermopile is hot the power will drop off or stop all together, thus extinguishing the pilot.

    Many homeowners make the mistake of setting the thermopile too far into the flame, heating the entire end, not just the top 1/3 portion thinking this will bake it into submission, or force it to make power when in reality it does the opposite.

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  • Contributor 12 Answers
  • Posted on Feb 11, 2013
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OK.. This woked great for me.. I have a Gas fireplace. the pilot light would work but would not be able to actually start the fireplace. The thermopile (little point close to the pilot) is not registering enough heat from the pilot in order to engage the gas.. I lit the pilot while holding the gas knob in correct postion. Took a lighter and heated up the thermopile for 5 seconds and turned on the gas. all good and lit p right away. May not be a long standing solution but I only need to light it once a year as it stays on for 6 months.

Jason.
Northern Ontario, Canada

  • 1 more comment 
  • terry clark
    terry clark Jan 04, 2014

    can anyone give me some advise ? my gas fireplace is not lighting the burner. the pilot light is on and when I turn the switch on to light the burner I smell gas and can light the burner with a match and it burns fine.

  • terry clark
    terry clark Jan 04, 2014

    I will add that at first

  • terry clark
    terry clark Jan 04, 2014

    i will add that first the burner would partially light and now not at all. as i said when I turn the switch on I smell the gas and can light it with a match. is this the thermopile not working ?

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0helpful
1answer

I have a four frypot dean deep fryer after moving and cleaning from around equiptment on of the four pots wont fire up is it the thermo pile or should look somewere else?

Hello! You did not include the model number in your question. With the model number I can look it up and tell a great deal about the appliance without actually physically seeing it.
You will need a multimeter to determine if the thermopile is good but before running any voltage test you should make sure the thermopile isn't charred and dirty on its surface. If so you can clean it up with sandpaper first, then check to see if the pilot stays lit. Also the pilot flame should be appropriate in size and should be a clean blue flame and the flame should be making good contact with the thermopile. The pilot will need to be cleaned if the flame is not right. Some gas appliances have both a thermopile and a thermo coupler..
At the main gas valve there will be some terminal screws with wires connected. You will be probing the two screw terminals "TH TP" and "TP". The multimeter should be set for DC voltage. Now before testing you will need to light the pilot and keep it on for a few minutes. Then with the gas turned back off check for millivolt readings at the two terminals. in the absence of the flame you should be reading 325 millivolts or more. If your reading is much less than that then your thermopile is defective. With the flame going the voltage should read near 125 millivolts or more. If the pilot won't stay lit and there is not a thermo couple but the thermopile passes the meter test then the problem is going to be in the gas valve. On occasion I have resurected the gas valve by giving it a sharp blow with a wrench. Sometimes the valve can develop debri in the form of a small granule of dust or corrosion and a swift blow is all that was needed to clear the valve and regain operability. But if that doesn't work don't beat the valve up! You can buy a rebuild kit or just buy a new valve.
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PILOT LIGHT WONT STAY LIT i CHANGED THERMOPILE

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Have a heatilator direct vent GC300ST 15+yrs pilot woont stay lit think I need a thermoplie where can I find ? thk you

You probably need a thermocouple. Any local fire log sales store typically has a thermocouple in stock. If your system has a thermopile as well and is 15+ years old, I'd suggest getting anew pilot assembly and installing it. This way all the parts are new and you won't have to replace another part in 6 months.
1helpful
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Pilot light wont stay lighted

Hi there.
Try cleaning the thermopile (cylindrical piece of metal behind the pilot) wwith a non-metal scrubbing pad. thermopile needs the heat of pilot flame to keep the pilot flame lighted as well as burners during operation.
Kindly check also if the gas has sufficient pressure.
Regards.
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check if the thermopile receives enough heat from pilot flame, if it does, replace the thermopile.
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I have a Marco gas fireplace model# 794019C. It is the millivolt pilot generator type. I first changed the thermopile and cleaned the spark ignitor to get it to light. I have checked continuity and...

Mike, I suspect that the problem you're having is not related to the new Thermoplie (Pilot Generator) you installed. Its with the Thermocouple. The clue was "Some of the time its hard to keep the pilot light lit". The Thermopile controls the opening and closing of the gas valve, when the wall switch is turned ON/OFF. The Thermocouple, is what keeps the gas valve open and pilot light lit all the time. If there's no flame heat on the Thermocouple, it closes the gas valve. Rather than replace it, you can try polishing it with some very fine sand paper, then wipe the tip with a cotton ball soaked in alcohol. If the Thermocouple is really pitted, don't attempt this. Just replace it. If you do replace it, when you make the connection to the gas control valve, finger tighten the nut, then tighten only 1/4 turn more with the appropriately sized wrench.

By the way, MARCO is no longer in business as MARCO Fireplace. It was purchased by Lennox Hearth, a division of Lennox Heating. And your model firsplace is no longer manufactured. If you continue to have problems with it contact Angie Parrish at Lennox via email [email protected].

Hope this helped you solve the problem. Please be kind enough to rate my response to you. Thanks and have a good day!
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I have a williams thermostart . It was off yesterday . today when i tried to start its not getting started . Can you please let me know how i can start it manually using ignition . its pretty cold today

Couple of quick questions: Is the pilot lit and the Control Knob turned to the ON position?
If not, turn it to the ON position.

Has the thermostat been set higher than the ambient room temperature?
If not, set the temperature at least 10 degrees higher than the ambient room temp and see it the burner lights?

Have you checked the outside vent, to make sure it's unobstructed?

If all above the above fails to provide a yes answer, then I suspect that the Thermopile has gone bad. The Thermopile generates milli-volts of electricity that opens the gas valve when your thermostat calls for heat. The heat from the pilot flame against the Thermoplie is what generates the milli-volts of electricity.

They are not difficult to replace and only requires a screw driver and an appropriately sized open end wrench to accomplish the task. You can probably order the part directly from Williams. Also, if you have misplaced your Owners Manual, ask them for one of those too. It will be of help to you now and in the future.

Hope this helps solve your problem.
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Pilot light keeps going out! Will not stay Lit.

Check if the the gas pressure is sufficient (as stated on unit's nameplate). Check if the hi limit device is good. Check also if the thermopile (cylindrical metal with two wires standing behind the pilot hood) is receiving enough heat from the pilot flame. The voltage generated by thermopile should be 500millivolts in order to open pilot and main valve. If there is 500millivolt on gas valve thermopile and the pilot flame does not stay lit, you have to replace the gas valve. If the thermopile is glowing red and the voltage generated does not reach 500 millivots, you have to replace the thermopile.
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You might want to see about getting your money back or swapping it for another. I'm guessing it is a natural gas model. If so check and make sure you have between 4 and 5 water columm gas pressure. If so I would start by checking the thermopile and make sure it's producing around 700 milivolts. If your not able to measure this or have the tools to do so, I would start by replacing the thermopile. (This is not a thermocouple.)If this does not fix the problem. You have a bad gas valve. Thermopile cost around $60.00. Gas valve runs around $30000You can go this web site for more info http://www.tmeinc.biz/xkeat.htm
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