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Posted on Nov 01, 2010
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Melted the piston and rings in cylinder 1 , the rest are fine ,will recondition the engine it solve it ?

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Robert Wooley

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  • Expert 190 Answers
  • Posted on Nov 01, 2010
Robert Wooley
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FIND THE CAUSE BEFORE YOU JUST REPLACE THE PISTON AND RINGS. MOST LIKELY TOO MUCH HEAT FROM CLOGGED FUEL INJECTOR. COULD HAVE INGESTED SOMETHING THAT DAMAGED THE TOP OF PISTON TO START THE PROBLEM. COULD HAVE OVERHEATED ALL OVER, BUT ONLY #1 WENT FIRST.
I WOULD FIND THE CAUSE BEFORE FIXING WHAT HAPPENED.
TAKE THE INJECTORS TO LOCAL INJECTOR SHOP BEING SURE YOU KEEP #1 SEPERATE AND TELL THEM WHAT HAPPENED.
THE DIESEL FUEL INJECTION REPAIR SHOP CAN USUALL TEST THESE TOO.
GO TO THE SHOP THAT REPAIRS INJECTOR AND PUMPS, NOT THE PLACE THAT WORKS ON BIG RIGS.
HOPE THIS HELPS, ROBERT

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1answer

Kubota V2003-TE Engine overheating help?

Hi, Do you have the correct radiator cap on check the pressure of the radiator cap is correct. Second I know this sound strange but crack two chicken eggs into your radiator top water, then run the machine for a while, check out if this solves the problem! if it works you had a leak in the radiator cores & it should now be okay & work well. If these fail to solve problem then I agree with your diagnoses IE: leaking head gasket Suggest first you try to check each cylinders pressure as one may have broken piston ring I had this happen on Iseki engine had to bore one piston hole out & new piston etc only 1-piston needed. Please leave me feedback, Malcolm Campbell.
1helpful
1answer

What should the psi compression be thanks.

It can vary between make and model of car. However, a general rule of thumb is that 135+ average is okay. Less than 85psi is pointing at something seriously amiss in the engine.

It can vary - some cars may have 125psi as 'average' compression.

Don't expect each cylinder to give the same compression reading as there will be a fluctuation. Another general rule of thumb is that there shouldn't be more than 10% variation between the readings. That is, if cylinder No1 is 135 psi, cylinder No2 shouldn't be less than '125 ish'.

If you suspect you may have compression issues, it's quite easy to do a bit of fault finding. Warm the engine first so that the pistons are expanded in the cylinders. Then do a dry compression (normal) test.

Here's some examples of compression tests on a 4 cylinder engine:
130 127 129 127

All compression readings are within 10% of each other. Fine.

Example 2:
95 95 129 127
Here, a low compression reading on cylinder 1 and 2 suggests a problem. It may be due to a faulty head gasket/cylinder head allowing compressed gases to be transferred via the defective head gasket from one cylinder to another.

Example 3:
130 80 129 127
Cylinder No2 has a problem. It's compression is way down. The other three cylinders are fine. So .. what is the cause of the low compression on cylinder 2? It could be a broken ring/cracked piston or a burnt exhaust valve.

This is where you do a second compression test - called the 'wet' test.

Squirt some light engine oil into each cylinder. Aim for the cylinder walls so that the oil can find its way down the walls and around the piston rings. Place a rag over each spark plug hole and spin the engine to expel excess oil.

The oil that you have sprayed into each cylinder will form a 'seal' around the piston ring. Do another compression test and note down the readings. Here's example 3 again:
Example 3:
130 80 129 127
.. with the low compression on cylinder 2.

If after carrying out the 'wet' compression test you have a reading along the lines of
130 100 129 127
suggests that the bore/piston rings in cylinder 2 are at fault. The compression has increased on No2 cylinder because of the oil forming a seal around the rings.

If there is no increase in psi on the wet test i.e
130 80 129 127
This suggests a burnt exhaust valve.
1helpful
2answers

Have a spark plug not firing.

Are you sure it's actually a plug?
Are you getting oil on the plug?
The plug may be firing but you may be losing compression which gives the symptoms of a misfire. As you've changed the plug, lead and coil this points to to a problem elsewhere.

Your first course of action should be to get a mobile mechanic carry out a diagnostic check for you.

To put your mind at rest, do a 2nd compression test using a light oil squirted into the bores:

Doing a Compression Test
Warm the engine. Remove all the spark plugs.
Get a pencil and piece of paper to note down the readings.
Put the compression tester into the No1 cylinder and crank the engine for 10 seconds.
Note down the compression reading.
Repeat process for all cylinders.

Here's an illustration of what you may expect on a 4 cylinder engine:
Cylinder 1 2 3 4
psi 125 122 120 124

125 is the uppermost figure for that engine. Here, this engine is fine. There's a slight variation in psi figures, but that's perfectly normal.

Here's the same engine:
Cylinder 1 2 3 4
psi 110 112 114 112

The psi reading is down. However, as all the figures are pretty much equal it doesn't indicate head /gasket problems. It may point towards worn pistons or burnt valves.

Now consider these psi readings:
Cylinder 1 2 3 4
psi 125 84 86 124

There's more than a 10% drop - a difference - between cylinder 1 and 2, and cylinders 3 and 4.
The compression readings for cylinders 2 and 3 is down; low. There's something clearly wrong.

It suggests that there is a defective head gasket between cylinders 2 and 3 or a crack in the cylinder head. The rising piston compresses the gases which escape into the adjoining cylinder via the defective gasket or cracked head.

However, it could also mean that there is a problem with the valves (burnt/not seating properly) or perhaps piston / ring problems.

A burnt valve - it's usually the exhaust valve as they bear the brunt of the combustion - can cause a reduction in engine power simply because the combustion process isn't occurring properly. Compressed air/fuel gets squeezed out of that cylinder because of the damaged valve . There even may be a misfire - a surge as the car runs.

Worn or broken piston rings allow compressed gases to leak past into the crankcase. A compressed crankcase can force oil out of the dipstick tube. The pressure in the crankcase will leak to atmosphere anywhere it can find an outlet.

The 2nd Compression Test
The second compression test is known as a 'wet test'. The first compression test was the dry test because no oil was added to the bores. The second 'wet' test can give an indication of whether it is the rings or valves at fault (though bear in mind rings and valves do not cause overheating or water in the coolant symptoms).

Spray a liberal amount of light penetrating oil into each cylinder - aim for the cylinder walls, not the centre of the piston. You want the oil to run down the cylinder wall and around the piston to form a seal.

Place a rag over each spark plug hole and spin the engine to eject the surplus oil.

Then carry out a full compression test noting down the results.

Here's the previous results with the 2nd compression readings added:
Cylinder 1 2 3 4
psi 125 84 86 124
Wet 128 112 110 126

The readings have increased. This because the oil sprayed into the bores has formed a temporary seal around the piston, thereby enabling the compression to be raised. It also indicates that the bores/rings are worn on cylinder 2 and 3 - the 'oil seal' has increased the readings but is still low in comparison with cylinders 1 and 2.

This could also indicate that in addition to worn rings there is also burnt valves. Oil cannot form a seal around a valve. A worn or split valve will cause a low compression reading and misfiring symptoms.
Compressions readings should be taken in conjunction with other symptoms. It will help you identify the problem:

Low compression readings between two adjoining cylinders point towards a head gasket/head fault if your vehicle has shown signs of coolant loss, coolant in the oil system - mayonnaise, overheating, rough running and lack of power.

If those symptoms are not present it points towards burnt valves/piston rings. A worn engine may be difficult to start and pressurise the crankcase, but it doesn't cause overheating problems.
0helpful
2answers

Oil coming out exhaust pipe, wont idle on 1968 VW motor

You need to remove the motor & dismantle it, then check the cylinder sleeves & pistons for wear, the rings will definately be worn. Best is to have the motor reconditioned if you are unable to do it yourself. There are no short cuts if oil is emitting from the exhaust.
0helpful
1answer

How do I remove the crankshaft on a 2006 trx 500

Hi Seneca, Do you really want to remove the crankshaft? We usually do that to recondition an engine (replacing pistons, rings, main bearings, connecting rod bearings oil pump, water pump and reconditioning of the cylinder head? It is major engineering work.)
What is it you want to do and why? John
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1answer

Leaking oil into the cylinder

This could be valve seals on these 2 valves. Or this could be bad alignment of the rings groves when they were installed. Have you done a compression test this is where i would start.And if you suffer low compression the compression rings could be broken or aligned improperly. If you need further help just ask me.Remember to rate my solution
0helpful
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The engine has blown. I need to replace it or change pistons and rings. How difficult is it to change pistons and rings?

It can be time consuming and the end result may not be desirable if you haven't done it before.
--- The following is just a sample of what to do once the engine is torn down: Pistons and Connecting Rods
  1. Before installing the piston/connecting rod assembly, oil the pistons, piston rings and the cylinder walls with light engine oil. Install connecting rod bolt protectors or rubber hose onto the connecting rod bolts/studs. Also perform the following:
    1. Select the proper ring set for the size cylinder bore.
    2. Position the ring in the bore in which it is going to be used.
    3. Push the ring down into the bore area where normal ring wear is not encountered.
    4. Use the head of the piston to position the ring in the bore so that the ring is square with the cylinder wall. Use caution to avoid damage to the ring or cylinder bore.
    5. Measure the gap between the ends of the ring with a feeler gauge. Ring gap in a worn cylinder is normally greater than specification. If the ring gap is greater than the specified limits, try an oversize ring set. Fig. 5: Checking the piston ring-to-ring groove side clearance using the ring and a feeler gauge tccs3923.gif

    6. Check the ring side clearance of the compression rings with a feeler gauge inserted between the ring and its lower land according to specification. The gauge should slide freely around the entire ring circumference without binding. Any wear that occurs will form a step at the inner portion of the lower land. If the lower lands have high steps, the piston should be replaced. Fig. 6: The notch on the side of the bearing cap matches the tang on the bearing insert tccs3917.gif

  2. Unless new pistons are installed, be sure to install the pistons in the cylinders from which they were removed. The numbers on the connecting rod and bearing cap must be on the same side when installed in the cylinder bore. If a connecting rod is ever transposed from one engine or cylinder to another, new bearings should be fitted and the connecting rod should be numbered to correspond with the new cylinder number. The notch on the piston head goes toward the front of the engine.
  3. Install all of the rod bearing inserts into the rods and caps. Fig. 7: Most rings are marked to show which side of the ring should face up when installed to the piston tccs3222.gif

  4. Install the rings to the pistons. Install the oil control ring first, then the second compression ring and finally the top compression ring. Use a piston ring expander tool to aid in installation and to help reduce the chance of breakage. Fig. 8: Install the piston and rod assembly into the block using a ring compressor and the handle of a hammer tccs3914.gif

  5. Make sure the ring gaps are properly spaced around the circumference of the piston. Fit a piston ring compressor around the piston and slide the piston and connecting rod assembly down into the cylinder bore, pushing it in with the wooden hammer handle. Push the piston down until it is only slightly below the top of the cylinder bore. Guide the connecting rod onto the crankshaft bearing journal carefully, to avoid damaging the crankshaft.
  6. Check the bearing clearance of all the rod bearings, fitting them to the crankshaft bearing journals. Follow the procedure in the crankshaft installation above.
  7. After the bearings have been fitted, apply a light coating of assembly oil to the journals and bearings.
  8. Turn the crankshaft until the appropriate bearing journal is at the bottom of its stroke, then push the piston assembly all the way down until the connecting rod bearing seats on the crankshaft journal. Be careful not to allow the bearing cap screws to strike the crankshaft bearing journals and damage them.
  9. After the piston and connecting rod assemblies have been installed, check the connecting rod side clearance on each crankshaft journal.
  10. Prime and install the oil pump and the oil pump intake tube.
  11. Install the auxiliary/balance shaft(s)/assembly(ies).
OHV Engines CAMSHAFT, LIFTERS AND TIMING ASSEMBLY
  1. Install the camshaft.
  2. Install the lifters/followers into their bores.
  3. Install the timing gears/chain assembly.
CYLINDER HEAD(S)
  1. Install the cylinder head(s) using new gaskets.
  2. Assemble the rest of the valve train (pushrods and rocker arms and/or shafts).
OHC Engines CYLINDER HEAD(S)
  1. Install the cylinder head(s) using new gaskets.
  2. Install the timing sprockets/gears and the belt/chain assemblies.
Engine Covers and Components Install the timing cover(s) and oil pan. Refer to your notes and drawings made prior to disassembly and install all of the components that were removed. Install the engine into the vehicle. Engine Start-up and Break-in STARTING THE ENGINE Now that the engine is installed and every wire and hose is properly connected, go back and double check that all coolant and vacuum hoses are connected. Check that your oil drain plug is installed and properly tightened. If not already done, install a new oil filter onto the engine. Fill the crankcase with the proper amount and grade of engine oil. Fill the cooling system with a 50/50 mixture of coolant/water.
  1. Connect the vehicle battery.
  2. Start the engine. Keep your eye on your oil pressure indicator; if it does not indicate oil pressure within 10 seconds of starting, turn the vehicle OFF. WARNING
    Damage to the engine can result if it is allowed to run with no oil pressure. Check the engine oil level to make sure that it is full. Check for any leaks and if found, repair the leaks before continuing. If there is still no indication of oil pressure, you may need to prime the system.
  3. Confirm that there are no fluid leaks (oil or other).
  4. Allow the engine to reach normal operating temperature (the upper radiator hose will be hot to the touch).
  5. At this point any necessary checks or adjustments can be performed, such as ignition timing.
  6. Install any remaining components or body panels which were removed. prev.gif next.gif
1helpful
1answer

Exhaust giving off white smoke when parked up with engine running audi a4

White smoke is caused by engine oil being burnt. If your vehicle is turbo charged then it is most likely the turbo bushes that are worn, allowing oil to escape into the exhaust system. This can also be caused by worn piston rings but is unlikely on a vehicle of this age unless it has overheated badly in the past. To check turbo, remove main intake pipe from turbo. Check for excessive movement on impeller shaft in turbo by moving it up and down. To check piston rings carry out a compression test or if you have the equipment a cylinder leakage test will give you a better indication of cylinder condition. If the Turbo is at fault it will need to be reconditioned or replaced. Check oil feed pipe to turbo for blockage or restriction [common fault].
0helpful
2answers

Spark to but No compression in 2nd cylinder

The most common cause of your problem would be a sticking or burnt valve the only way to know for sure is to remove the head and check then it will need a valve grind and head machined before replacing you may find it cheaper to hunt around for a good secondhand engine to have fitted in your car.
The head of the piston in each cylinder is designed to compress fuel so that it is combustible (explosive/flamable) when it is ignited by the spark plug. The compression is maintained by O-rings on the piston which do not allow fuel to escape past it. In your case, either an O-ring is damaged or the piston itself isn't working properly and it is not compressing the fuel as it should.
Hope this helps, best regards :)
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I am having trouble starting my car , when it was started it would stall . i had the pressure checked . it was only 15lbs of prssure and its suposed to be 45lbs . what could it be

Did you check each cylinder. Very unusual for them all to give the same reading. If you just checked one and got 15lbs then it could be a few things. Worn valves, cracked or worn cylinders, cracked head, or broken,worn piston or piston ring's. All this can be checked by removing the cylinder head. First check all cylinders for preasure if they are 25lbs or less your engine is excessivly worn and will need reconditioning or replaced.
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